Intro

Jeff Battersby (0s)

You just text me when you're angsty.

Tom Anderson (0s)

I do, yeah, you're the dear Abby of my life.

Intro music (10s)

♪ I don't wanna know about your imperfections, too ♪

Tom Anderson (11s)

Hello everyone and welcome to Basic AF. Tom Anderson and Jeff Battersby with you once again. Thanks for being here. Jeff. How are you, sir?

Jeff Battersby (19s)

I am very well, Tom Anderson.

Jeff Battersby (23s)

Yeah, good.

Jeff Battersby (24s)

Got a little soccer in today.

Jeff Battersby (25s)

It's a beautiful fall day.

Jeff Battersby (26s)

It was cold this morning, man.

Tom Anderson (28s)

It was crisp.

Jeff Battersby (28s)

Had to wear the hat when I was starting to play,

Jeff Battersby (31s)

but sweat a little bit, and now I'm all good.

Tom Anderson (32s)

And you want to.

Jeff Battersby (35s)

So that's a good thing.

Jeff Battersby (37s)

So it's always a good day when there's soccer in.

Tom Anderson (37s)

Except you're pretty much crippled.

Jeff Battersby (40s)

Say that again.

Tom Anderson (41s)

So you're pretty much crippled.

Tom Anderson (42s)

That's what you told us before we started.

Tom Anderson (43s)

It took you 30 minutes to walk from the car to the house.

Jeff Battersby (43s)

Well, I told you it took me half an hour to get out of my car after the game because I was, uh...

Tom Anderson (47s)

Yeah.

Jeff Battersby (49s)

Because I'm old and my bones and muscles don't recover like they did when I was a kid, so...

Jeff Battersby (56s)

Yeah, so I'm a little late, but, you know, whatever. We're here, and we're also here with

Jeff Battersby (1m 2s)

our friend Joe Moyer, who we ripped off last time he was here because Apple decided to announce some stuff the same day that, uh...

Jeff Battersby (1m 12s)

the same day that Joe was supposed to be on, and, uh...

Tom Anderson (1m 15s)

Which they nearly did again.

Jeff Battersby (1m 15s)

He is...

Jeff Battersby (1m 17s)

Nearly right. If...

Joe Moyer (1m 18s)

Yeah, we just squeaked it in.

Jeff Battersby (1m 19s)

But Joe is the journaling guide and we're gonna talk about journaling. So Joe, welcome.

Joe Moyer (1m 27s)

Thank you.

Joe Moyer (1m 28s)

Thanks for having me back.

Jeff Battersby (1m 29s)

Yeah, pleasure. Uh, no, no. It didn't work. We're giving you a second chance, I think is what it is.

Joe Moyer (1m 29s)

I must have done okay the first time.

Joe Moyer (1m 31s)

No, no.

Joe Moyer (1m 32s)

Okay.

Joe Moyer (1m 33s)

Okay.

Joe Moyer (1m 34s)

All right.

Joe Moyer (1m 35s)

Thanks.

Tom Anderson (1m 36s)

It's okay, we're on Chance 47 and it still doesn't work for us, so.

Joe Moyer (1m 36s)

I'll do my best.

Jeff Battersby (1m 38s)

Yeah, right, right, right. We fake it every show.

Tom Anderson (1m 44s)

Which by the way, dear listener, this is episode 47.

Tom Anderson (1m 47s)

Show notes can be found at basicafshow.com/47.

Jeff Battersby (1m 52s)

And at the top of the show, let's remind you that our music, show music, Psychokinetics,

Jeff Battersby (1m 57s)

Celsius 7. We highly recommend that you check them out. And also our pretty brilliant

Jeff Battersby (2m 6s)

podcast art, the logo, Randall Martin Design. And we still think it's the best looking art on any of the podcasts that we see.

Tom Anderson (2m 17s)

And by the way, we do still have stickers and magnets.

Jeff Battersby (2m 19s)

Yeah.

Tom Anderson (2m 20s)

So if you would like one or both, hit us up, be happy to send it to you.

Jeff Battersby (2m 22s)

Yeah, yes, right, we'll stick it to you, right.

Tom Anderson (2m 25s)

No charge on the house, as they say.

Tom Anderson (2m 28s)

Jeff covers the postage, so I don't care.

Jeff Battersby (2m 32s)

And I'm up to my ears in money, so it's all good, no worries.

Tom Anderson (2m 38s)

Yeah, that's how it is.

Tom Anderson (2m 39s)

So few episodes ago when we did have Joe on and the iPhone event kind of took precedence there.

Tom Anderson (2m 45s)

Are we?

Tom Anderson (2m 47s)

And we're going to talk about journaling, and so we wanted to bring Joe back to have that discussion because that just happens to be his forte.

Hello Again Joe Moyer!

Tom Anderson (2m 57s)

And so Joe, we're again thankful to have you back here with us for this episode.

Tom Anderson (3m 3s)

So why don't you, in case anyone missed the first go-round with you, why don't you do a little brief intro, tell us a little bit about yourself and how you got into journaling and we'll kind of go from there.

Joe Moyer (3m 13s)

I'd love to.

Joe Moyer (3m 14s)

So I was journaling when I was younger.

Joe Moyer (3m 17s)

Throughout my 20s, I did a ton of journaling.

Joe Moyer (3m 21s)

Even younger than that, I was doing it.

Joe Moyer (3m 23s)

And I kind of fell off in my 30s.

Joe Moyer (3m 26s)

Life just got kind of busy.

Joe Moyer (3m 28s)

In many ways, it got simpler.

Joe Moyer (3m 30s)

I got a steady job, great girlfriend,

Joe Moyer (3m 33s)

who I ended up marrying.

Joe Moyer (3m 35s)

So I wasn't doing a ton then.

Joe Moyer (3m 36s)

And then I came back to journaling just about three years ago,

Joe Moyer (3m 40s)

maybe a little bit more than that,

Joe Moyer (3m 42s)

when our second kiddo was born.

Joe Moyer (3m 43s)

And I just realized that I needed a little more reflection in my life.

Joe Moyer (3m 48s)

And you know, you have one kid and it's one thing you add another to the pile and it's it sort of changes the game a little bit.

Joe Moyer (3m 55s)

And I also took a break from from work.

Joe Moyer (3m 57s)

So I started writing online too.

Joe Moyer (3m 59s)

So I started my website 24 letters.

Joe Moyer (4m 2s)

I actually remember coming up kind of with the basic idea

Joe Moyer (4m 6s)

right after he was born.

Joe Moyer (4m 7s)

I was still in the hospital, you know, just kind of resting and hanging out

Joe Moyer (4m 10s)

and journaling kind of came along with that.

Joe Moyer (4m 13s)

And then I realized maybe what I was figuring out and learning is something I could share with with other people.

Joe Moyer (4m 18s)

And that kind of took off when Threads launched.

Joe Moyer (4m 21s)

I was it was a day one Threads user.

Joe Moyer (4m 23s)

And I started on there as the journaling guide and that slowly creeped its way into being more of the focus on the blog.

Joe Moyer (4m 31s)

And then I started a newsletter also called the journaling guide and that goes out every two weeks and I talk about all things journaling, whether it's some of the people in history who've been journaling, offering prompts or tips or ideas or motivation.

Joe Moyer (4m 44s)

And people seem to like it. I've gotten some really, really positive feedback.

Joe Moyer (4m 48s)

So I'm happy to share some thoughts with you guys today.

Jeff Battersby (4m 51s)

Awesome. And we're happy to hear him. So I'm curious, you said you started, uh, you started journaling when you were younger. When did you first start journaling? And what precipitated that? You know, what, what was it, uh, that got you started on, on, you know, keeping a log or at least getting your thoughts

Let’s Talk Journaling

Joe Moyer (5m 11s)

That's a great question.

Joe Moyer (5m 11s)

I think I probably started when I was like 20 or 21.

Joe Moyer (5m 15s)

Um, I was doing a lot of reading at the time.

Joe Moyer (5m 18s)

You know, I was, I was very interested in exploring the world.

Joe Moyer (5m 20s)

Like a lot of people that age are still am that has not, I've not lost that curiosity.

Joe Moyer (5m 25s)

And, uh, some of the people I was reading were kind of, uh, their writing was almost in the format of a journal.

Joe Moyer (5m 32s)

Um, there is a, a writer.

Joe Moyer (5m 34s)

He does spoken word.

Joe Moyer (5m 36s)

He was a musician, is a musician.

Joe Moyer (5m 37s)

Uh, his name's Henry Rollins.

Joe Moyer (5m 39s)

I don't know if you guys are familiar with him.

Joe Moyer (5m 41s)

Yeah.

Joe Moyer (5m 41s)

So he was, he was pretty influential when I was a younger man, especially.

Joe Moyer (5m 45s)

Um, Tony Bourdain, when, when he first started his, his career as a writer.

Joe Moyer (5m 50s)

Um, so my life was not nearly as exciting as either of those two guys.

Joe Moyer (5m 54s)

Um, but I felt like I wanted to start writing things down and, uh, very quickly found it to be helpful in a lot of ways.

Joe Moyer (6m 2s)

And I just kind of stuck with it.

Jeff Battersby (6m 3s)

And so what were some of the ways that you found it helpful at that at that time?

Joe Moyer (6m 8s)

It was a great way to figure stuff out, right?

Joe Moyer (6m 12s)

When you're in your early 20s

Joe Moyer (6m 15s)

In hindsight now in my 40s life was probably pretty simple, but you're figuring stuff out. You're experiencing things for the first time

Joe Moyer (6m 22s)

And it was really helpful to to just record thoughts

Joe Moyer (6m 26s)

In a private way, although around that time. I was also doing some some public blogging like we used to in the in the early 2000s

Joe Moyer (6m 34s)

But it was it was sort of a safe place to put thoughts down to figure out

Joe Moyer (6m 41s)

Relationships with other people relationships with myself where I wanted to go where I was coming from

Joe Moyer (6m 46s)

Just a lot of reflection and some of it was also just day-to-day stuff. Just kind of recording what I did that day

Joe Moyer (6m 52s)

And kind of building my own narrative to figure figure out where I was headed

Jeff Battersby (6m 57s)

Very cool, so

Jeff Battersby (6m 59s)

two kids decide it's time to

Joe Moyer (7m 3s)

Yeah, yeah.

Jeff Battersby (7m 3s)

Put things down on paper again

Jeff Battersby (7m 6s)

Was it strictly speaking?

Jeff Battersby (7m 8s)

you know the fact that you suddenly you're responsible for two little humans or

Jeff Battersby (7m 13s)

you know were there other things that that moved you into the

Jeff Battersby (7m 20s)

The space where you wanted to put things put things down to understand yourself

Joe Moyer (7m 28s)

Yeah, that was a big piece because obviously your relationships change.

Joe Moyer (7m 31s)

Um, when you have one kid, it changes when you have another kid it changes.

Joe Moyer (7m 36s)

Um, I also took a break from work, which had a pretty significant impact on me.

Joe Moyer (7m 42s)

I wasn't, I wasn't aware of how important it was for me to go to work every day and have that connection and frankly that validation.

Joe Moyer (7m 50s)

Um, so journaling really helped me parse a lot of those thoughts about, you know,

Joe Moyer (7m 56s)

why was it so hard for me to stay home?

Joe Moyer (7m 58s)

Um, why, why did I really feel like I needed that external validation when I had two great kids and an amazing wife and a family here at home?

Joe Moyer (8m 7s)

Um, so it was kind of just continuing the journey of, of what I was doing in my twenties and my forties, and maybe I thought I had stuff figured out and maybe I did, uh, but I, I found a whole bunch of new stuff to figure out and journaling has been the most effective way for me to do that.

Jeff Battersby (8m 22s)

That's amazing. That's really cool. Does your wife journal too?

Joe Moyer (8m 26s)

She doesn't.

Joe Moyer (8m 28s)

She's dabbled in it like I think most people I know and probably most people on the planet.

Joe Moyer (8m 34s)

Like she has a journal.

Joe Moyer (8m 36s)

Most of us have journals laying around somewhere.

Joe Moyer (8m 39s)

But I don't think she does it consistently.

Jeff Battersby (8m 41s)

And you do it every single day.

Joe Moyer (8m 44s)

Yeah, so I do, every day I do just a gratitude journaling entry in day one typically.

Joe Moyer (8m 52s)

It's quick, it can take a minute, five minutes.

Joe Moyer (8m 56s)

It doesn't take very long.

Joe Moyer (8m 58s)

And it is a daily habit that I really try to do every single day.

Jeff Battersby (9m 1s)

Okay. And day one's the app that you're currently using.

Joe Moyer (9m 6s)

Yeah, so I use day one for, I don't know how many journals I have,

Joe Moyer (9m 10s)

but I have a bunch of them. Um, and that's where I keep most of them.

Joe Moyer (9m 14s)

I do use journal from Apple as well, uh, which is a great little tool.

Joe Moyer (9m 17s)

Unfortunately it's only on the, on the iPhone.

Joe Moyer (9m 20s)

I did email Tim cook to see if we could have it on the iPad.

Joe Moyer (9m 22s)

Haven't heard back yet. Um, so I'll let you guys know. Uh,

Joe Moyer (9m 28s)

they're asking about the Mac, but that might be pushing it. So, um,

Joe Moyer (9m 31s)

day one is sort of my primary,

Joe Moyer (9m 32s)

but I also have print journals that I like to write into cause I think there's

Joe Moyer (9m 36s)

something pretty special about writing by hand.

Jeff Battersby (9m 38s)

Mm-hmm. Yeah, I agree with you

Jeff Battersby (9m 40s)

Very cool. Yeah, I want to talk look go ahead

Tom Anderson (9m 41s)

Yeah, Jeff, you're a journaler too, right?

Jeff Battersby (9m 44s)

um, so that's an that's an interesting question in my

Jeff Battersby (9m 50s)

Late teens and early 20s journaled quite a lot. I have a

Jeff Battersby (9m 56s)

Bunch of those journals still in around all by hand

Jeff Battersby (9m 59s)

and

Jeff Battersby (10m 3s)

You know what's interesting if I if I look back at it and this is I think one of the one of the amazing

Jeff Battersby (10m 8s)

things about journaling is that at least for me I have what I would call I guess a fair amount of sense memory so I can read articles that I wrote you know for macro other places a long time ago and I can remember the music that was playing at the time that I was writing those articles like it I'm tied to that the thing about reading my journals is I I can I can pick back up on the internal things that I was feeling one of the things and I've never said this publicly here but I've suffered from depression for a very long time probably since I was in my early teens but never saw it as such you know it was never a thing that that it wasn't a thing really that I started you know taking some medication for and going to therapy for until probably my late 40s early 50s you know it was just an edge of that that I that I was hanging on to and one of the things I recognize about my journals at that time I was in very much a church environment and there's a certain facade you got a place at the front and in the background you know there's other things going on maybe that you're not telling everybody and so I do know that my journal while not always transparent about those kinds of things you know was was

Jeff Battersby (11m 38s)

you know I can I can still remember what it was I was going through when I was writing writing certain things to the present I don't journal technically I write a ton I read a ton every day and a lot of that is working things out, but it's not working things out in the same way that I would be working

Jeff Battersby (12m 8s)

journals. So the answer is, you know, that's a very long, long way of saying that I do not presently journal. Um, I have tried to use a couple of apps. I have to say that handwriting things for me is, is a better means of that. I'm a collector of notebooks. I have a million notebooks and I have written notes in those things. You know, I, I, you know, field notes.

Jeff Battersby (12m 30s)

Um, I could probably start a field notes store, uh, if I wanted to, because I have, I, they're

Joe Moyer (12m 34s)

Oh wow. They're great. Yeah, they're beautiful.

Jeff Battersby (12m 38s)

Yeah. So I, yeah, that's it. Collector being the operative, uh, the operative word. What I will say though, is I, um, you know, I do a lot of theater, um, in a variety of ways,

Tom Anderson (12m 39s)

I feel like we need to add that to your bio on the show page.

Tom Anderson (12m 42s)

Jeff Battersby, collector of fine notebooks.

Joe Moyer (12m 45s)

Yeah. Most people are.

Jeff Battersby (12m 54s)

you know, I'm directing shows, I'm acting in shows, I'm stage managing shows. Um, and when I am doing theater, particularly when I'm acting, I will keep journals around my character, you know, to kind of have a, gain a deeper understanding.

Jeff Battersby (13m 8s)

you know, of, of who that, who that person is.

Jeff Battersby (13m 10s)

So definitely within that realm, but not specifically what you're doing, Joe, which is, you know, doing it every day.

Jeff Battersby (13m 18s)

Tom, do you journal at all?

Tom Anderson (13m 20s)

Uh, I do not, um, I think I've done maybe five journal entries ever.

Tom Anderson (13m 26s)

Um, but I do, yeah, you're, you're the dear Abby of my life, but, um, and I was talking to Joe before we started, um, I do, I'm like a prolific note taker at work, um, and that's,

Jeff Battersby (13m 27s)

You just text me when you're angsty.

Joe Moyer (13m 30s)

Bye bye.

Tom Anderson (13m 46s)

I guess, in some ways, a form of it, but.

Tom Anderson (13m 50s)

Like for personal things, I don't really do that, but at work, like I take a ton of notes pretty much every day.

Jeff Battersby (13m 55s)

Well, and you also and maybe this wouldn't qualify as journaling in the in a specific sense But you do really map things out in a way that I don't you know, I carry everything in my head So when dimension dimension comes for me, I'm done. You know, I don't I don't have I don't have anything

Joe Moyer (14m 7s)

I hate you.

Tom Anderson (14m 7s)

And I won't be able to find my files, so it's okay.

Jeff Battersby (14m 11s)

But but you you do and you've shown me on many occasions you think a lot on paper

Tom Anderson (14m 12s)

I'm done too.

Jeff Battersby (14m 17s)

You know or not technically paper you think on an iPad

Tom Anderson (14m 17s)

I do, yeah.

Tom Anderson (14m 21s)

Right, yeah.

Tom Anderson (14m 22s)

So I'll start with, for things that,

Tom Anderson (14m 24s)

and I've shared pictures of that on threads a few times,

Tom Anderson (14m 27s)

but if I have things that I need to kind of really think through,

Tom Anderson (14m 31s)

and again, it could be home projects,

Tom Anderson (14m 35s)

but it's not really like perfect.

Tom Anderson (14m 38s)

which maybe I should do that, I'll think about it.

Tom Anderson (14m 41s)

But home projects, work projects, anything,

Tom Anderson (14m 43s)

whether it's related to this podcast or whatever it is,

Tom Anderson (14m 46s)

is I do like to sit down and kind of start, you know,

Tom Anderson (14m 49s)

with the Apple pencil and sketching things out.

Tom Anderson (14m 51s)

And then eventually if it's something that I really need to organize,

Tom Anderson (14m 56s)

it'll go over into my note as a mind map.

Tom Anderson (15m)

And I'll hammer on that for weeks,

Tom Anderson (15m 3s)

and then I'll go back and look at it and update it some more 'cause typically for those bigger things.

Tom Anderson (15m 7s)

It's something that's not going to be done quickly anyway.

Tom Anderson (15m 10s)

And so I can kind of bounce to it and come back,

Tom Anderson (15m 12s)

work on some things, go back, update it.

Tom Anderson (15m 15s)

And I really like that approach.

Tom Anderson (15m 16s)

It just helps me.

Tom Anderson (15m 18s)

That seems to fit the way that I think.

Joe Moyer (15m 22s)

Yeah, so it sounds to me like you both journal. You just do it in ways that work for you.

Tom Anderson (15m 26s)

Different ways, right, yeah, right.

Joe Moyer (15m 26s)

You know, I'm a big fan. I made the joke on the last show I was on about lighting the candle,

Joe Moyer (15m 32s)

you know, and kind of going into your study and doing the journaling or the diary entry.

Joe Moyer (15m 36s)

And I actually got some feedback on that. People thought that was sort of humorous. But,

Joe Moyer (15m 42s)

you know, I think that's sort of the classical take on what journaling is, dear diary.

Joe Moyer (15m 46s)

But I really think journaling is a function of just figuring stuff out. And it can be

Joe Moyer (15m 52s)

however you want to do it. So you may do it in different ways or it may serve different purposes.

Joe Moyer (15m 56s)

But I feel like what you're both doing is kind of serving a similar.

Tom Anderson (16m 2s)

Right. Yeah. And I think that might be part of the struggle people have with it, too, is trying to fit, "Well, I don't do journaling because I don't sit down and write it into a day one or a journaling app or on some paper." Or it doesn't fit this particular process that, like, Joe, you just alluded to there is kind of the journaling de facto definition, maybe. But yeah, I think a lot more people do it than they think.

Joe Moyer (16m 22s)

Yeah, the ritual, yeah, I would agree with that.

Joe Moyer (16m 27s)

I would agree with that.

Jeff Battersby (16m 29s)

Yeah, and I think, you know, I think you can extend that then to any kind of creative act,

Jeff Battersby (16m 37s)

you know, whether it's photography, you know, which is, photography really is documenting something that you've seen, you know, or that has caught your attention. Painting, you know,

Jeff Battersby (16m 49s)

any of these things that you're doing that's actually taking something inside of you and putting it into a, not necessarily a public place, but a place that's outside of yourself that you can then view it and think about it.

Jeff Battersby (17m 4s)

So, with that in mind, the hardest thing, you know, for anybody doing anything is the blank canvas, the blank page, the blank, you know, the getting started. So, Joe, from your perspective,

How to Begin Journaling

Jeff Battersby (17m 18s)

you know, how is a good place to begin? You know, not so, you know, you don't have to have

Jeff Battersby (17m 29s)

anything like that. Like, what would you, if I were to come to you and say, hey Joe, you know,

Jeff Battersby (17m 34s)

I really do want to start journaling, you know, but I don't have a lot to say, you know, I don't have a lot to put down on the page. It seems, you know, bad not to put something brilliant down.

Jeff Battersby (17m 47s)

So, how do I do it? What would you say to someone that was asking you about how to begin?

Joe Moyer (17m 56s)

Yeah, so I've had this conversation and I think the first step is you have to believe and accept that your thoughts matter and

Joe Moyer (18m 3s)

They are worthy to be on the page or wherever you decide to put them

Joe Moyer (18m 7s)

I like to say on some of my writing that your story matters and you need to start writing it down right now Right, you know today

Joe Moyer (18m 15s)

The other thing we get hung up on sometimes is sort of the perfect journaling fallacy where the perfect journal fallacy Excuse me where we have that really nice journal we got from the store and it's really pretty and you know it's kind of...

Joe Moyer (18m 26s)

I can't write in that because it's the paper is too nice right so it goes up on the shelf and then you go get something else and that's part of the product like we just like to collect notebooks I think it's it's some sort of you know sort of ancient thing that we love texts even if we don't write in them but really understanding that your your thoughts are worthy of being on that in that fancy notebook or anywhere so the first step is is to find something to write with and right on, you know, you can be really agnostic.

Joe Moyer (18m 56s)

about the tools you choose.

Joe Moyer (18m 57s)

Um, you can grab printer paper and a pencil, right?

Joe Moyer (19m)

It's, it's really about just, just kind of getting started, um, the notes app on your phone or even voice memos can be a great way to do it if you want to do it kind of more stream of consciousness and you don't feel like writing.

Joe Moyer (19m 12s)

Um, and then you need a little, a little quiet time, you know, maybe five, 10 minutes of quiet time.

Joe Moyer (19m 18s)

It doesn't have to be perfect.

Joe Moyer (19m 19s)

It can be in the car, in the, in the driveway.

Joe Moyer (19m 22s)

If you're in an office environment, you can shut your door for a few minutes.

Joe Moyer (19m 26s)

Maybe that's where you find it before you go into bed, when you're waking up,

Joe Moyer (19m 30s)

that's usually a good time. And then just write a thought.

Joe Moyer (19m 33s)

Try not to get hung up on the desire to be profound.

Joe Moyer (19m 38s)

You don't need to worry about being Shakespeare or, you know,

Joe Moyer (19m 43s)

writing like an emperor or something. Just write what's on your mind.

Joe Moyer (19m 47s)

And I've found that when you write one sentence,

Joe Moyer (19m 51s)

sometimes that's all you need.

Joe Moyer (19m 52s)

But oftentimes, that's either going to trigger you to write a little more.

Joe Moyer (19m 56s)

Or it's going to kind of help you move the stuff around in your brain.

Joe Moyer (20m)

So that next time you come back to that page, you might have another thought to add or another idea or another question.

Joe Moyer (20m 6s)

And, uh, you know, you talked a little bit about your mental health journey, Jeff.

Joe Moyer (20m 10s)

And, and I've struggled a little bit with that too, particularly after my second kiddo was born.

Joe Moyer (20m 15s)

And I don't, I'm not a mental health professional, but I really think that journaling can help sort some of that stuff out and, and kind of, um, getting started is not as hard as we think it is.

Joe Moyer (20m 26s)

You just have to understand that our thoughts are, are valuable and worthwhile.

Joe Moyer (20m 30s)

And they don't have to be for anybody else.

Joe Moyer (20m 32s)

So you don't have to impress anybody, but just putting them down on the page, uh, can, can really make a difference.

Jeff Battersby (20m 37s)

Yeah, I think that's a really important piece.

Jeff Battersby (20m 41s)

I think one of the things you just said a second ago about the amount of time that you need,

Jeff Battersby (20m 48s)

which is not a lot, you can, in five or fewer minutes,

Jeff Battersby (20m 55s)

put a thought down and have it be as simple as,

Jeff Battersby (20m 59s)

it was sunny out today and I went to work.

Jeff Battersby (21m 7s)

The temptation to be profound, I think is,

Jeff Battersby (21m 11s)

that's one of the real difficulties.

Jeff Battersby (21m 13s)

I think with any endeavor, that's creative,

Jeff Battersby (21m 20s)

the need to be, as you said, Shakespeare,

Jeff Battersby (21m 24s)

but the need to really be eloquent.

Jeff Battersby (21m 26s)

And you don't need to be eloquent.

Jeff Battersby (21m 28s)

It doesn't need to be any more than that.

Jeff Battersby (21m 30s)

And I think that's a really important starting point.

Jeff Battersby (21m 37s)

I've never used, day one,

Jeff Battersby (21m 39s)

I have played around with Apple's journaling app.

Jeff Battersby (21m 41s)

I find that I really don't wanna be journaling on my phone.

Jeff Battersby (21m 46s)

The fact that you can now mirror your phone on your Mac,

Jeff Battersby (21m 51s)

makes that a little easier.

Jeff Battersby (21m 55s)

But one of the things I really do like about it is it will prompt you.

Jeff Battersby (22m)

You took a trip to so-and-so and you took some pictures.

Jeff Battersby (22m 2s)

Why don't you write about that for a second?

Jeff Battersby (22m 6s)

So what is it?

Jeff Battersby (22m 7s)

You said that you use Apple's journaling app.

Jeff Battersby (22m 10s)

You said that your, it sounds like day one is your primary.

Day One App for Journaling

Jeff Battersby (22m 13s)

What is it?

Jeff Battersby (22m 14s)

What is it about day one that makes that your most common go to?

Joe Moyer (22m 22s)

Well, I've been using it a long time.

Joe Moyer (22m 24s)

I think I started using day one for the first time back in, it must've been 2013 maybe.

Joe Moyer (22m 32s)

And then I really started using it again semi-regularly

Joe Moyer (22m 37s)

in like 2016, 2017.

Joe Moyer (22m 38s)

So I like that it's multi-platform.

Joe Moyer (22m 41s)

I like that it syncs.

Joe Moyer (22m 42s)

It's been around for a while.

Joe Moyer (22m 44s)

It doesn't really feel like it's going anywhere.

Joe Moyer (22m 46s)

It was sold a while back, but it seems to be pretty stable.

Joe Moyer (22m 51s)

I like the ease of creating multiple journeys.

Joe Moyer (22m 52s)

I've got a bunch of journals, some of which only have a couple entries, but some of them are more almost project-based.

Joe Moyer (22m 59s)

And I also like that I can create templates.

Joe Moyer (23m 3s)

So when I open up a gratitude journaling entry shortcut on any of my devices, it just opens a new entry in the gratitude journal with the prompt that just says, "What are you grateful for today?"

Joe Moyer (23m 16s)

So you know, it's digital though, right?

Joe Moyer (23m 18s)

So you lose some of that connection with the handwriting.

Joe Moyer (23m 20s)

So what I do when I write in my

Joe Moyer (23m 22s)

handwritten journal is I will just grab a photo of it and put it into day one because I like to have it all there. So it's mostly personal preference and it's what I've used forever.

Jeff Battersby (23m 33s)

Yeah, and I think, you know, the old adage about photography, you know, what's the best camera you can get?

Jeff Battersby (23m 40s)

The one that's with you, right?

Jeff Battersby (23m 42s)

So having, you know, having something close at hand where you can put that down, you know,

Jeff Battersby (23m 50s)

where you can put down those thoughts, it's really great.

Jeff Battersby (23m 53s)

And you know, it's funny, I don't think about, you know, a journal about being grateful,

Jeff Battersby (24m 1s)

that's a really, it's a really--

Jeff Battersby (24m 3s)

really simple thing and that can be one or two thoughts.

Jeff Battersby (24m 6s)

My kids, my wife, you know, the fact that I can still get out of my car after I play soccer.

Joe Moyer (24m 11s)

Yeah, even if it takes you a little while, right?

Jeff Battersby (24m 13s)

A half an hour ride, right?

Joe Moyer (24m 14s)

Yeah.

Joe Moyer (24m 15s)

Uh, day one's great.

Joe Moyer (24m 17s)

And I know journal does this too, but I put photos in all the time of, I just go and see what we did that day and drop a photo and a thought in, um, and it's nice to go back and look at that journal in particular over the years, because you see, you can see your kids growing up or you see something fun you did.

Joe Moyer (24m 32s)

Uh, some of the other journals, I feel like I've written in them and I've never gone back because I got what I needed in the moment, right?

Joe Moyer (24m 37s)

I, I figured out what I needed to figure out when it's there.

Jeff Battersby (24m 42s)

back in the early blogging days,

Jeff Battersby (24m 44s)

and I don't know if you're doing this now.

Jeff Battersby (24m 46s)

I mean, I've been to your website,

Jeff Battersby (24m 47s)

but I haven't looked to see.

Jeff Battersby (24m 49s)

Do you post public journals?

Joe Moyer (24m 54s)

No, yeah, I did.

Jeff Battersby (24m 54s)

I mean, blogging would have been that.

Jeff Battersby (24m 55s)

So you're, blogging would have been.

Joe Moyer (24m 58s)

And it was, it was mostly mundane stuff or what you would expect kind of a 21 year old to write about.

Joe Moyer (25m 4s)

And, you know, like political stuff, music, movie, you know, yeah.

Jeff Battersby (25m 9s)

Mm-hmm.

Tom Anderson (25m 9s)

Henry Rollins.

Tom Anderson (25m 10s)

Yeah.

Joe Moyer (25m 11s)

You know, I saw, I saw him at the Egg in Albany a lot there, Jeff.

Joe Moyer (25m 14s)

So not too, not too, too far from where you're at, but yeah.

Jeff Battersby (25m 15s)  

• No, no, that's not far at all.

Joe Moyer (25m 17s)

Um, yeah, you know, it was, it was a little probably, uh, brooding, right.

Jeff Battersby (25m 18s)

Yeah, he's right up the road.

Joe Moyer (25m 22s)

'cause I was a 21-year-old.

Joe Moyer (25m 24s)

Who thought the world was out to get me?

Joe Moyer (25m 25s)

So yeah, I knew it.

Jeff Battersby (25m 27s)

It was. I mean... [laughs]

Joe Moyer (25m 30s)

Henry was right.

Joe Moyer (25m 33s)

But no, typically I write about journaling.

Joe Moyer (25m 36s)

I do try to share personal reflections.

Joe Moyer (25m 40s)

Same thing in the newsletter,

Joe Moyer (25m 42s)

but not so much the more personal stuff.

Tom Anderson (25m 46s)

Yeah.

Tom Anderson (25m 47s)

And we talked there just a second ago about the gratitude component.

Gratitude and Positivity

Tom Anderson (25m 51s)

And I think that's something that really is key for folks.

Tom Anderson (25m 57s)

I think there's so much negativity in the world today and in our personal lives.

Tom Anderson (26m 1s)

And it's, you know, it's so easy to beat ourselves up when we start something new.

Tom Anderson (26m 6s)

Like, oh God, that episode sucked or that edit wasn't good or, oh, my kids hate me because I didn't take them to the park or whatever it is.

Tom Anderson (26m 14s)

And most of it is just nonsense.

Tom Anderson (26m 16s)

True.

Tom Anderson (26m 17s)

But that negative self-talk is so defeating, but it's so easy to fall into rather than focusing on the, because we, part of it is because I think we're, we overestimate how much external people care about those little things that we do or don't do and that they don't care.

Tom Anderson (26m 37s)

Like the positive things we don't think they care enough about, but the negative things we think they just focus on.

Tom Anderson (26m 42s)

And I think it's a big thing.

Tom Anderson (26m 46s)

To be able to flip that switch, and it takes a lot of time to do it because I used to be very bad with that negative self-talk, poor self-image, all of those types of things.

Joe Moyer (26m 57s)

Me too. And I'm still not great, but I'm getting better. Yeah. Yeah. Right.

Tom Anderson (26m 58s)

And, yeah, it's still a work in progress. I don't think you ever defeat it because I think, especially if you start to stack some losses, right?

Tom Anderson (27m 8s)

Like we've had some health things here at the house and, you know, my son broke his arm. My other son had the accident. Two appliances went out.

Joe Moyer (27m 10s)

Yep.

Joe Moyer (27m 15s)

Yeah.

Tom Anderson (27m 16s)

Years ago, Tom would have been like, "God, life sucks. This is BS, and you can't," you know, all these types of things.

Tom Anderson (27m 23s)

And it's taken a lot of work, and a lot of that goes back to what we're exposing ourselves to, the information we see on social media.

Tom Anderson (27m 34s)

It's very easy because of algorithms. You go down a rabbit hole, and then, you know, it's not – I don't believe it's like an evil thing necessarily that Diago is just going to feed you.

Joe Moyer (27m 39s)

Definitely, yeah.

Tom Anderson (27m 46s)

The happy things or positive things, we'll call them, you know, reinforcement things, it'll feed you those too.

Tom Anderson (27m 50s)

So it's not going to necessarily just feed you the bad things, but it will if you keep going down that spiral.

Tom Anderson (27m 56s)

And so I think just be very careful with the things you're exposing yourself to and the messages and the tone and the types.

Tom Anderson (28m 7s)

Especially now we're in the most god-awful time of year, which is the political hype.

Tom Anderson (28m 12s)

And so turn all that BS off because just.

Tom Anderson (28m 16s)

Just do it.

Tom Anderson (28m 17s)

Um, and so, but I think if you can do that with your journaling and just start to start something simple with, with the gratitude component, to go back to that.

Tom Anderson (28m 28s)

Um, for the day, like Jeff mentioned there, I think a few minutes ago,

Tom Anderson (28m 31s)

Sonny, I went to work or maybe Joe, you said that I can't remember.

Joe Moyer (28m 33s)

Jeff. Yeah, but that's perfect. There you go. Right.

Tom Anderson (28m 34s)

Um, yeah, it doesn't have to be a big thing.

Tom Anderson (28m 37s)

Um, it could be something a little, because, you know, I heard something.

Tom Anderson (28m 42s)

I forget where I heard it, but it was years ago and it really smacked.

Tom Anderson (28m 46s)

in the face, you know, and I think this may have even been what kick started me to go down this path was someone stated, the next time that you drive by the hospital, look up at the windows and there's going to be somebody laying in that room that would give everything to have the opportunity that you have today.

Tom Anderson (29m 8s)

And I was like, man, that's a kick in the face.

Joe Moyer (29m 10s)

Yeah, that's some real perspective.

Tom Anderson (29m 11s)

And it is, and especially as you start to see, you know, we're all kind of creeping

Tom Anderson (29m 16s)

there.

Tom Anderson (29m 17s)

Our parents are getting up there or our friends or whatever.

Tom Anderson (29m 18s)

And it's really started to resonate with me.

Tom Anderson (29m 22s)

And so try to focus on that.

Tom Anderson (29m 24s)

But anyway, I've talked long enough.

Joe Moyer (29m 25s)

No, it's it's it's good. It's good to hear. It's powerful. I think we have a bias for negativity I don't know again if it's like because we used to be hanging out in the planes and had to watch for lions and stuff But yeah, I think you're right You know if you go on to into social and you're just looking at cooking videos

Tom Anderson (29m 30s)

Thanks.

Joe Moyer (29m 39s)

You're just gonna get cooking videos But I think we have a tendency to be a little more curious about some of the stuff that's probably not as good for us

Tom Anderson (29m 46s)

Yeah, well, because it feels good to get tweaked up a little bit.

Jeff Battersby (29m 46s)

And I think we're often more, it does, right, cortisol baby, everybody loves a little cortisol.

Joe Moyer (29m 49s)

Yep until you're too too high right and then you got gotta shake it up right, right

Tom Anderson (29m 52s)

Right, right.

Joe Moyer (29m 55s)

Yeah, yeah, right, yeah

Tom Anderson (29m 56s)

Give me that drip.

Jeff Battersby (29m 59s)

I was going to say too, we have a tendency, I think, to be more generous with others than we are with ourselves. And I think that that's almost universal for anybody that's a thoughtful person.

Jeff Battersby (30m 14s)

you're often...

Jeff Battersby (30m 17s)

your interiority,

Jeff Battersby (30m 19s)

what you're thinking in your head,

Jeff Battersby (30m 22s)

is often much more

Jeff Battersby (30m 29s)

negative than you would be with anybody else.

Jeff Battersby (30m 31s)

They're not things that you say.

Jeff Battersby (30m 33s)

So I think journaling gives you the room to give yourself the grace to say,

Jeff Battersby (30m 39s)

you know what, today was okay.

Jeff Battersby (30m 42s)

I was okay.

Jeff Battersby (30m 43s)

Here's some things that I could learn.

Jeff Battersby (30m 45s)

Here's some things that I can do.

Jeff Battersby (30m 47s)

But overall,

Jeff Battersby (30m 50s)

I love my family.

Jeff Battersby (30m 52s)

I heard some birds.

Jeff Battersby (30m 56s)

Just to tell you how old I'm getting,

Jeff Battersby (30m 57s)

I'm sitting in my backyard just watching birds.

Joe Moyer (31m)

Sounds great.

Jeff Battersby (31m 1s)

It is...

Jeff Battersby (31m 3s)

I cannot tell you how calming that is, though.

Jeff Battersby (31m 7s)

It's like a...

Jeff Battersby (31m 8s)

It's an amazing thing that we,

Jeff Battersby (31m 10s)

with earbuds in our ears,

Jeff Battersby (31m 12s)

and videos in our hand,

Jeff Battersby (31m 14s)

the...

Jeff Battersby (31m 16s)

You know, you miss those things.

Jeff Battersby (31m 18s)

They're entertaining, but they're not as peace-inducing as, you know, sitting in the yard.

Tom Anderson (31m 27s)

Yeah, so Joe, if people are listening and we're 30 minutes or so in and these things are striking chords with folks, how would you recommend they best start?

Tips to Build the Journaling Habit

Tom Anderson (31m 41s)

What ways could they kind of start to slowly form the habit?

Tom Anderson (31m 47s)

Maybe some tools they could use or techniques that they could use is probably a better word.

Joe Moyer (31m 51s)

Yeah, that's a great question.

Joe Moyer (31m 53s)

I think we were just talking about how we're more critical of ourselves.

Joe Moyer (31m 57s)

And I think one thing to keep in mind is to treat yourself like your best friend.

Joe Moyer (32m 1s)

And if you can do that more often than not,

Joe Moyer (32m 4s)

it's gonna be helpful, including with journaling.

Joe Moyer (32m 7s)

So I think starting with whatever tools are easiest for you to use and tools you prefer.

Joe Moyer (32m 14s)

So if you like to write by hand, find a notebook.

Joe Moyer (32m 19s)

if you're worried about the...

Joe Moyer (32m 21s)

Kind of the perfect journaling thing popping up and you don't want to get into that trap where you're the kind of person who you go to buy the expensive notebook at the fancy stationary store, then go to your, uh, you know, go to your CVS or your Rite Aid and get a 99 cent spiral bound notebook.

Joe Moyer (32m 38s)

Um, the message is going to matter way more than the medium, but the medium has to work for you.

Joe Moyer (32m 43s)

Um, you could use, uh, you know, audio again, you could, you could record a voice memo, um, notes app.

Joe Moyer (32m 49s)

You don't have to spend any money either.

Joe Moyer (32m 51s)

The printer, we all have a printer, even if it's in the closet,

Joe Moyer (32m 53s)

we haven't used in 10 years.

Joe Moyer (32m 54s)

There's probably paper in there.

Joe Moyer (32m 56s)

Um, uh, or, you know, your, your kids go grab something from, from, from their room, if, if it's, if it's a problem with being kind of overwhelmed by perfection.

Joe Moyer (33m 6s)

Um, and you know, again, find a little bit of time.

Joe Moyer (33m 10s)

You don't need a lot of time, but, but find some time, try to find some quiet time if you can, because having a little bit of space is helpful for the process.

Joe Moyer (33m 19s)

Um, in fact, I think too much

Joe Moyer (33m 21s)

a great idea either because then you're just sitting there staring at the paper.

Joe Moyer (33m 24s)

So I'm really trying to, to, to find the time and finding it when it's, when it's the best time of day for you.

Joe Moyer (33m 31s)

So I think a lot of people who do gratitude, gratitude journaling do in the morning.

Joe Moyer (33m 35s)

I do it at night.

Joe Moyer (33m 36s)

It just works better for me.

Joe Moyer (33m 37s)

Um, and I, I seem to have the same effect.

Joe Moyer (33m 41s)

Um, and then, you know, write, write down what you want to write down.

Joe Moyer (33m 44s)

You, you can be profound.

Joe Moyer (33m 45s)

You might come up with profound stuff.

Joe Moyer (33m 47s)

The other day I was outside and I noticed the leaves are really crunchy And I put wrote that down and I thought that's kind of cool.

Joe Moyer (33m 51s)

Like, you know, how many times do I walk through leaves in New England?

Joe Moyer (33m 53s)

But today I noticed that they're crunchy.

Joe Moyer (33m 56s)

Um, the more you do it, I think the harder it gets in a way where not the harder it gets, I think it challenges you in a good way because I'm very grateful for my wife and my kids and I write that often, but some days I think I look a little deeper now because I, I'm sort of aware that I might want to share this,

Joe Moyer (34m 14s)

uh, with myself at the end of the day.

Joe Moyer (34m 16s)

Um, and then the last thing kind of on that subject is.

Joe Moyer (34m 21s)

You can tell people you're journaling, or you don't have to tell people you're journaling. Um, you know, it's almost, it's sort of like therapy.

Joe Moyer (34m 26s)

So I I've done a little bit of therapy in my life and I told everybody, you know, cause I thought it was great. It helped me. Maybe it'll help you. Right.

Joe Moyer (34m 32s)

But some people, they don't want to talk about that stuff.

Joe Moyer (34m 34s)

So journaling can be private.

Joe Moyer (34m 36s)

It can be something you share with your family and friends. Um,

Joe Moyer (34m 39s)

I'm just the guy out here who decided that most people I've met would probably be better if they did some form of, of journaling reflection process.

Joe Moyer (34m 48s)

Um, so I think that's a great way to start.

Joe Moyer (34m 51s)

Find tools that, that work for you. Um,

Joe Moyer (34m 55s)

keep it simple and try not to get hung up on perfection.

Jeff Battersby (34m 59s)

That's great. Good advice all the way around. As Tom said, we're coming near the end of this episode. Just a reminder, where can we find...

Where to Find Joe

Joe Moyer (35m 9s)

So you can find me on threads, that's pretty much the only social that I'm active on, I'm at The Journaling Guide.

Joe Moyer (35m 17s)

You can get to the newsletter now by typing, I got the domain so I finally linked that up so you can go to thejournalingguide.com and then my website is 24letters.net and you can either type the numbers or you can spell it out, I got both because that day I was apparently extra crafty and thought ahead.

Joe Moyer (35m 34s)

So yeah, feel free to reach out, this is probably a blessing, I don't get...

Joe Moyer (35m 39s)

a ton of email from people, but if you have questions or thoughts, I'm always happy to chat a little bit about what you're doing and see if I can help.

Jeff Battersby (35m 48s)

Awesome Well, Joe, thanks so much for coming on with us again I think you and I gonna kick Tom to the curb on this one at some future

Joe Moyer (35m 57s)

Right. I'd love to. Yeah. Tom, you could, you could come on, you know? Yeah. Well, that good? Yeah. Yeah. Thank you guys. It's been a pleasure.

Jeff Battersby (35m 58s)

point are gonna talk Apple TV Plus, I think that'll

Tom Anderson (36m 1s)

I knew it. I knew that was coming. As soon as I was kicked to the curb, I knew what it was for.

Jeff Battersby (36m 5s)

Yeah, well Tom Tom's like oh, yeah, okay, I

Tom Anderson (36m 9s)

God, you guys could have done that today and I could have taken the weekend off.

Jeff Battersby (36m 10s)

Watched a 15-minute video in my vision Pro. Yeah. Well, we could have right but we

Jeff Battersby (36m 15s)

We promised journaling now, it's it's

Jeff Battersby (36m 18s)

really great to have you on Joe. And really grateful. Really grateful that you've, you know, deigned to spend your time with us.

Joe Moyer (36m 27s)

I thoroughly enjoy it.

Joe Moyer (36m 29s)

So anytime you guys ask me and I'll be here, be happy to talk TV.

Jeff Battersby (36m 30s)

That right there.

Joe Moyer (36m 32s)

Tom, you could join us, you know, the engineer, right?

Joe Moyer (36m 34s)

So you could just be the engineer and pithy, pithy comment here and there.

Tom Anderson (36m 35s)

Right, sure, I'll just sit here, sure, I'm okay with that.

Joe Moyer (36m 39s)

Thanks guys.

Tom Anderson (36m 40s)

But yeah, no, we do really appreciate it.

Tom Anderson (36m 42s)

And thanks for the flexibility with kind of back room talk,

Tom Anderson (36m 46s)

we had to rearrange the schedule a little bit.

Tom Anderson (36m 47s)

So appreciate the flexibility there and open invite.

Tom Anderson (36m 51s)

So if there's anything that you think of too,

Tom Anderson (36m 52s)

that you ever wanna discuss,

Tom Anderson (36m 54s)

and we'd love to have you back on.

Close

Tom Anderson (36m 59s)

All right, Jeff, you wanna do the closing credits as we call it?

Jeff Battersby (37m 1s)

Sure. So, Tom is our engineer for all things sound and editing.

Joe Moyer (37m 6s)

Sorry, Tom.

Jeff Battersby (37m 7s)

That's all right. That's an important note.

Jeff Battersby (37m 12s)

We don't often give Tom credit for the work that he does.

Jeff Battersby (37m 15s)

I'm the gentle listener.

Jeff Battersby (37m 18s)

Tom will edit everything and send it to me.

Tom Anderson (37m 21s)

But you don't understand how much I appreciate that because I always stress like something's going to go out. That's not right So at least you're listening to it takes that away There's a perfectionism thing that we talked about Joe. That's not so fun

Jeff Battersby (37m 29s)

Do listen to it

Joe Moyer (37m 32s)

Treat yourself like your best friend, even when you're editing your podcast.

Tom Anderson (37m 33s)

right [laughing]

Jeff Battersby (37m 36s)

So show editing is is definitely Tom as we sit at the top of the show music

Jeff Battersby (37m 42s)

psychokinetics Celsius 7 check them out

Jeff Battersby (37m 45s)

Celsius 7 does have a new

Jeff Battersby (37m 48s)

pretty chill album out

Jeff Battersby (37m 51s)

Within the last six seven months. So if you look for Celsius 7 you will find his fine work

Jeff Battersby (37m 59s)

And is our is our show artwork the two goofy robots, which look just like Tom and me

Joe Moyer (38m 8s)

Just like yeah, it's it's spitting image

Jeff Battersby (38m 8s)

You know, it's true, right?

Tom Anderson (38m 9s)

Yep

Jeff Battersby (38m 11s)

It kind of is sad to say

Jeff Battersby (38m 15s)

As we like to say even even even Tommy's sleepy eyes

Tom Anderson (38m 16s)

Somehow we got married

Tom Anderson (38m 20s)

Yeah [laughing]

Joe Moyer (38m 21s)

The dreamy podcast to be on guys, I'm I'm really really honored

Jeff Battersby (38m 23s)

Yeah

Jeff Battersby (38m 25s)

And thanks to everyone for, you know.

Jeff Battersby (38m 29s)

Burn in a half an hour or so with us.

Jeff Battersby (38m 31s)

We really are grateful for everyone that's listening and there are more and more people listening every day.

Jeff Battersby (38m 35s)

So please, you know, report us to the authorities.

Jeff Battersby (38m 39s)

And by that, I mean, you know,

Jeff Battersby (38m 42s)

make sure that you give us a rating on your favorite podcast app.

Jeff Battersby (38m 45s)

And, you know, you can reach us via the,

Jeff Battersby (38m 50s)

either feedback@basicafshow.com or within the, your favorite podcast app,

Jeff Battersby (38m 56s)

there's a link where you can send us a message.

Jeff Battersby (38m 59s)

Like some lady that I know asked me if I was playing games instead of working.

Tom Anderson (39m 7s)

She was right.

Jeff Battersby (39m 7s)

She was, I was talking about playing,

Tom Anderson (39m 11s)

I appreciate you looking out for me, Jeff's mom.

Jeff Battersby (39m 11s)

playing the latest Switch game.

Jeff Battersby (39m 14s)

Yes, mom, I'm working, I promise.

Jeff Battersby (39m 16s)

Anyway.

Jeff Battersby (39m 21s)

Anyway.

Jeff Battersby (39m 23s)

So thanks so much for spending time with us.

Jeff Battersby (39m 24s)

We're super grateful.

Tom Anderson (39m 26s)

All right, that will do it.

Tom Anderson (39m 27s)

Joe, thanks again, sir.

Tom Anderson (39m 28s)

Appreciate it.

Joe Moyer (39m 30s)

Thank you guys.

Tom Anderson (39m 30s)

And listeners, we do appreciate you very much for being here.

Tom Anderson (39m 34s)

So until we talk again, have a great rest of your day or your night,

Tom Anderson (39m 38s)

whatever the case may be, and we'll talk to you then.

Outro Music (39m 39s)

I don't wanna know about your imperfections, dude Prefer to leave you on a pedestal so I'll improve 'Cause if I'm finding out you know more than I'm just like you That gon' smash my whole world Lost in illusion, drowning myself up in the sauce Put my glasses on, pack whatever, wind my watch 'cause…

Jeff Battersby (39m 40s)

See ya!